What is the real Oriental Orthodox Churches problem in Kolenchery Church in India?

We heard some news from Indian newspapers about the some parish problems in Kolenchery, in South India. We heard the Church spiritual leaders started the hunger strike for entering the Church. How to solve that problem in  the way of Christianity? Indian Orthodox argues that the Church is their own. But the Syrian Orthodox Church (Jacobites) argues that the Church is their own. What is the real truth?

38 comments:

  1. Kolenchery Church is an Indian Orthodox Church. Not Jacobite church

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    1. If jacobite give this church to orthadox then it is orthadox church.sorry no chance.

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    2. none of the historical proof have mentioned kolenchery church belongs to orthodox group.

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  2. Wouldnt it be best if a delegation arrive from sister oriental orthodox churches and see for themselves the real problem? The Syriac Orthodox Church, in line with Bible had asked for mediation from all Christian Churches to solve this dispute. They even have signed documents to prove this...All this while it was the Indian Orthodox Church which said and rather exhort the great pagan values of India and its corrupt judicial system to solve this dispute. Time and again..The Indian Orthodox Church cites racism as the main accusation .. For egwhy do the american copts or american armenians need a middle easter Pope or catholicose.. when they can have an american for that purpose.. would anyone of you agree?.. even now they publicise the fact that they are more patriotic inorder to brainwash the rest of the other communities to turn against the Syriac Orthodox...

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  3. You'll get more info from the following site

    http://www.malankarasyriacvoice.com/

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  4. Kolenchery St. Peters church does not belong to Indian Orthodox Church. Actually, Indian orthodox Church was born after the establishment of Catholicose of the East in India in 1913. It is true that a district court in Kerala has decided that the Indian Orthodox faction has absolute authority over the Parish. But that verdict is not final and it is being challenged in the High Court of Kerala. AGAIN, THE DECISION OF HIGH COURT CAN BE CHALLENGED IN SUPREME COURT. So it may take many more years to get a final verdict on this issue. So it is premature to conclude that the church belong to Indian Orthodox Church.

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  5. it belongs to syrian orthodox(Jacobite) church..

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  6. Kolenchery Cchurch is established as a church under the holy see of Antioch and all the east. Total family under Kolenchey St. Peter's & St paul's is around 2000 and more than 1500 families belongs to Syrian Orthodox church which is also known as Jacobite syrian church. As per the Last Supreme Court judgement, churches should be ruled by the church members. so Then how the Indian Orthodox can say Kolenchery Church belongs to them

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  7. They should fight each with "pathal" similiar to "chevakar" in olden days. Staring from layman, then priests, bishops and finaly between he Bawa. Those who die become Martyrs and God is with the winner or who retains till last

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  8. In India all churches, temples and mosques are built with public fund. The locals contributed for their construction and hence the ownership should be with the local public. No Bishops, or Sannyasis or Maulavis can claim their ownership. It is a public property. if a division come among the public , then it can be taken over and run by government by forming a board( like Devasam board). Another option is , one party can take it and the other party should compensated according to the actual market value. Now-a-days, some people who consider and elevated themselves as saints & representatives of faithfuls create all problems. The political parties should have strong will to handle such people instead of licking their.... for vote bank.
    Kolenchery church is a typical example for such confrontation.

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  9. Dispute Kolenchery Jacobite Church

    St. Peter's and St.Paul's Jacobite Syrian Orthodox Church is one of the important churches which situate in the heart of the Ernakulam District, where the strong hold of the Jacobite Church. It was even from its beginning a Jacobite Church, but when the two factions, ie both Jacobite and the Indian Orthodox, were joined to be a single church in 1960s accepting the Syrian Orthodox Patriach of Antioch and all the East as the supreme head of Church, this church came under the influence of the Bishops, who were in favour of the Indian Orthodox Faction and this church is also accepted the Constitution of the Malankara Syrian Orthodox Church, which was passed in 1932, which considers the Catholicose and the Malankara Metropolitan as the Custodian of all the Churches and Church Properties. In 1970s, many of the members of the episcopal synod of this joined Church including its Catholicose and the Malankara Metropolitan, rejected the authority of the Syrian Orthodox Patriarch of Antioch and all the East and began to claim that the Catholicose in India is the supreme head of the syrian Church in India and is chairing the Throne of St. Thomas, the apostole of India, and catholicose and Patriarch are in same ecclesiastical status. This arguments were contrary to the settlement agreements of the 1960s and unhistorical, so that a division in the church became necessary. Most of the Church members rejected this heritic attitude and it caused many suites in Police stations as well as in the Courts.

    This St. Peter's and st.Paul's Jacobite Syrian Orthodox Church in Kollanchery also rejected the heretical Indian orthodox Church authority and admitted the Syrian Orthodox Patriarch as the Supreme head of the Church and is controlling by the Jacobite faction. The indian orthodox Church leaders gave many cases in the Court asking the authority over the church, because this parish also accepted once when the Church was together, the 1932-Constitution of the Church, so that this church and its properties are not of its people, but of its Catholicose and the Malankara Metropolitan. Meanwhile Indian Orthodox faction could find a support of 250 families out of 2000 families of the Church.

    In Kolenchery church, the majority were the Jacobites, and they were in control, but the court verdict which came last week conferred the ownership of the chapel and the church on the Orthodox faction, leading to a chaos on Sunday as heads of both groups went on fasting to assert the power of the factions.

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  10. every one in kerala can tell one thing
    the church belongs to Indian orthodox

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  11. Let the jacobites share all their chyrches with the orthodox faction first. Then they can come to Kolenchery and get their share. Wow!!! Isn't that a fair decision !!!!

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  12. Kolenchery Church belongs to Indian Orthodox Church. Amicable settlement by both parties is not likely in this case. All should accept the court verdict. Why some people are creating unnecessary hues and cries? During these days also, some people wants to be under foreign occupation of Antiochiah. In Antiochia, they dont have even 10000 members and they want to come here and control the Malankara churches. If Jacobite faction wants to be a separate entity, it ok. But they should not create problems in the churches.

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  13. who created problems ?? u orthodox are creating problems!!
    before that i want to ask one thing.. why the orthodox people are trying to take over ONLY the FAMOUS and PROFITABLE churches..? y?? u people are interested more in money??
    And above it was said that orthodox doesnt support foriegn rule or occupation or etc..etc..
    then y r u using syriac in ur holy qurbono..and y r u using the same dressing style and prayer patterns and everything and still saying " we dont accept antioc " "we dont accept patriarcese".. funny!!

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  14. KOLENCHERY CHURCH BELONG TO JACOBITE.

    ORTHODOX IS A REAL-ESTATE GROUP.THEY ALWAYS LOOKING OTHERS PROPERTY.

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  15. WHY THIS ORTHODOX PEOPLE NOT UNDERSTANDING.

    WITH MONEY THEY CANT CHANGE THE TRUE FAITH.

    THIS VICTORY IS NOT PERMANENT.

    ONCE YOU TAKE ALL YOUR WORDS BACK.

    WAIT AND SEE.

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  16. The Malankara Orthodox Syrian church has created a separate church, a separate head citing that the biblical church of Antioch is foreign and so is the Patriarch of Antioch installed by the apostles including St Peter & St Thomas brothers in Christ where St Thomas accepts St Peter as his Bishop & brother in Christ. If St Peter is foreign is St Thomas not. I wonder if they will claim Jesus Christ to be a foreigner and declare someone else as god just because Christ was born & lived in another country.

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  17. My dear friends y do u accuse Orthodox church running behind money, wat is Jacobite church doing? Last year during Parumala Perunnal Jacobite faction converted a family to jacobites and bought their entire land offered huge sums of money. This land is just opposite to Parumala Pally. will it not create a trouble in future, most of the cases in court are filed by Jacobite faction ultimately they have lost all, Jocobite faction tried to bribe most of the families surrounding to get converted from Orthodox christians to jacobite chrisitians, wats all these crap, Jacobite factions disagrees with Malankara since being a heretic sabha with St.Thomas as a patron head or founder of church of malankara, then y do Jacobites call themselves as malankara. Jacobites crown their bishops only if that individual can afford to pay lakhs to become a Bishop, this was said by one of the priests who left Jacobite faction and joined Orthodox, numbers speak, 4 bishops of Jacobite faction joined Malankara Orthodox Sabha since they feel its the true sabha.. Y do u tell Orthodox a real estate sabha when Jacobite sabha made a website in the name of Parumala Pally which is well known asked people to donate funds for it and people r well aware that Parumala pally is called for Parumala church already situated in parumala which belongs to Malankara Orthodox church. everybody knows who is looting money, Our bava H.H. Moran Mar Baselios Marthoma Paulos II, is on fasting whereas Jacobite faction's thirumeni is just on a prayer having 3 meals everyday. Such a shame when Jacobite Faction couldn't take the challenge with right spirit, Jacobite faction ever thrashed Media persons who came to shoot true colours of Jacobite factions. Its understood over the years Jacobite factions haven't won any cases they filed against Orthodox church, Then its time to relook if they are a sabha, because they don't have a identity, they depend on Syrian Patriarch somewhere in some world who is very much dependant on money generated from Jacobite churches, its a shame, Have an identity guys, Be proud to call St.Thomas christians or else stop the claim over Malankara. One more instance recently spiritual heads of other sabhas and other religious organisations showed solidarity and support to our Bava thirumeni, which shows we are true wat v claimed for. u can increase number of families in Kolenchery overnight but u can never ever buy the support of God. God will punish u all jacobites as always. Jai Jai Catholicos.

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    1. Everything you have said is contradicting.
      Jacobite church are not like Orthodox we do not steal churches and we have great relations with all Malankara Churches.
      We do not oppose Malankara, we are the Malankara Church that belongs to the Patriarch.
      We do not bribe Judges.
      We do not use the media as propaganda.
      Parumala Church was always a Jacobite Church, it is now in Orthodox control.
      But guess what? More people come to the current Jacobite Parumala Church than the old one which is currently under Orthodox control.
      You claim apostolic Succession but your church was founded only in 1912.
      The Anglican Church is older than your church!
      There is no Apostolic succession.
      You are free to join the true church.
      The Syriac Orthodox Church.

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  18. I am from Orthodox and my wife is from Jacobite….while my wife is not hardcore Jacobite, my in laws are hardcore….so it has resulted in some heated movements between my in-laws and myself….this is only topic that my in-laws and myself disagrees….we meet our in-laws only twice a year and every time there would be some issue with both the denominations, which gets into a heated discussion…so to maintain peace, my wife has instructed that there would be no discussion with respect to both factions…I met my in-laws last week and no discussion happened and we had a wonderful holiday….
    While I was very upset seeing some of the earlier comments in this site and wanted to react badly…but didn’t as it would only flare up the emotions…we will not get any peace….so would request all of you not to talk bad of the other side and focus on areas that can help ease the tension….

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  19. Under 1934 constitution Patriarch of Antioch is the spiritual head
    Catholicose is the asset head
    So catholicose of the IOC is only a CFO ( chief finance officer ) of the malankara church All who methrans and priests under him should change their name to Asst CFO and Deputy CFO respectively and should handle only the money matters they should not be allowed conduct qurbana and all that
    patriarch and his deputy will fulfill the spiritual needs of the people by conducting qurbana in churches, all will be under patriarcate of antioch as per supream court order
    Those who are not under antioch should form seperate church
    Those people who say we will acknowledge the patriarchate of antioch only as per constitution should give the same status to catholicose and his deputy also
    Parish people at kolenchery is fully under patrircate of antioch then who the third man will come and say a CFO to conduct qurbana in kolenchery church

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  20. there was no consititution written in 1934 .. All there is is a paper signing that Indian orthodox is being separated from Jacobite Syrian denomination.... and this is all due to one thirumeni VATTASSERIL! when the thirumeni had died for 5 consecutive years there was no tom, dick or harry to turn around and pray for him ... now that he is been placed as a saint wat a havoc is created! i can say this anywhere due to vattaseeril thirumeni is rather my close cousin!

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  21. Can you say Any Catholicose churches been attacked? Can you find anybody from Jacobite is creating problems in Parishutha Parumala Pally, they are just coming there to be with Parishutha Bawa's Kabar and to pray.

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  22. well, you jacobites must understand one thing. the patriarch in antioch is using you people so that he can gain control over your churches. we respect the great syriac tradition of antioch, but you should know that you are being duped. the kolenchery church was and will be the property of the indian orthodox church.

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  23. FULL HISTORY OF METHRAN KASHY SABHA –READ------------------------------
    "SHAME TO THE CHRISTIANITY "

    When Mar Dionysius VI became the Malankara Metropolitan, the Patriarch demanded a registered deed from Mar Dionysius declaring perfect allegiance to the patriarch as the BAVA KASHY people are doing now Mar Dionysius strongly refused to yield to the demands of the Patriarch.

    The Patriarch excommunicated Mar DionysiusVI on 31st May 1911.The excommunication of Mar Dionysius created divisions in the Malanakara Church.
    Those who supported Mar Dionysius were called METHRAN KASHY and those who supported Patriarch of Antioch called BAVA KASHY
    It is evident that methran kashy sabha was formed only in 1911 and Bava Kashy (People believing in Antioch was their long before).It is also evident that methran kashy had been expelled from Syrian church in 1911 itself

    The consecration of the Catholicose (MARTHOMA SIMHASANAM BY ANTIOCH SIMHASANAM)

    When the Patriarch excommunicated mar Dionysius VI, there were two Patriarchs of Antioch; one was Abdulla who had powers according to the LEGAL DOCUMENTS knows as Firman of the Turkish government and the other was Abdedmassiah who was senior and at the same time INACTIVE at Turkey since the government withdrew his firman.

    Abdulla was the one who excommunicated the Malanakara Metropolitan Mar Dionysius. The METHRAN KASHY contacted Abdedmassiah and invited him to Malankara. The patriarch came and presided over the meetings of the FRAUD Synod of the METHRAN KASHY Church that decided to consecrate an asset head ( Catholicose) for the Malankara Church. Mar Ivanios Metropolitan of the Kandanadu Diocese was unanimously proposed to the post of Deposed Catholicose.

    On 15th September 1912, at St. Marys Church founded by St.Thomas in Niranam, Mar Ivanios Metropolitan was consecrated with the name Mar Baselios Paulose First as the first Deposed Catholicose of METHRAN KASHY . The chief celebrant of the consecration ceremony was the Deposed Patriarch Mar Abdedmassiah himself. After the consecration the Deposed Patriarch issued two Kalpanas declaring the importance, privileges, powers and functions of the Deposed Catholicose.

    All the authorities and privileges enjoyed by the Deposed Patriarch in the Church as its head was given to the Deposed Catholicose also by the deposed Patriarch

    DEPOSED PATRIARCH CAN ONLY INSTITUTE A DEPOSED CATHOLICOSE

    By the consecration of the Deposed Catholicose the Indian Church asserted and declared its full autonomy and became a full autocephalous (having its own head) Church and separated from Syrian church (BAVA KASHY)

    The Patriarchate was developed in Russian Orthodox Church between 1448 and 1589. In Rumenia it was established in 1885. The Serbian Patriarcahte was established in 1879 and the Bulgarian patriarchate was established in 1883. The patriarchate of Ethiopea was established in 1958 only. It happened in the METHRAN KASHY CHURCH in 1912. That is how methran kashy sabha evolved

    THE PEOPLE WHO BILIEVE IN ANTIOCH WAS HERE LONG AGO BEFORE 1912 , PEOPLE BELIEVING IN ANTIOCH ARE LIVING TODAY ALSO .THOSE WHO REFUSED ANTIOCH AND FORMED A METHRAN KASHY SABHA SHOULD KEEP THEM SEPARATE .WHY ARE THEY ATTACKING OTHERS "SHAME TO THE CHRISTIANITY "

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  24. THE CONSTITUTION
    OF THE
    MALANKARA ORTHODOX SYRIAN CHURCH
    1 DECLARATION
    1 The Malankara Church is a division of the Orthodox Syrian Church. The Primate
    of the Orthodox Syrian Church is the Patriarch of Antioch.
    PLEASE CORRECT IT AS
    THE TRUE CONSTITUTION
    OF THE
    MALANKARA ORTHODOX MARTHOMAN CHURCH (Methran Kashi Sabha)
    1 DECLARATION
    1 The Malankara Church is a division of the Orthodox Marthoman Church. The Primate
    of the Orthodox Marthoman Church is the Catholic of Kerala.
    THOSE WHO BELIEVE IN THIS SHOULD STAY AWAY FROM SYRIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH

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  25. kolenchery st. peters church is belong to MALANKARA ORTHODOX SYRIAN CHURCH(METHRAN KAKSHI).
    AND JACOBITES ARE MAKING PROBLEMS AND THEY ARE ATTACKING ORTHODOX PEOPLE.I AM REALLY A JACOBITE ,BUT IN THIS CASE I AM WITH ORTHODOX CHURCH....

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  26. No!!!! they are "Malankara orthodox marthoman church" .They are not part of syrian orthodox church under patriarch of Antioch,they are independent church having their own head at Kottayam. when they attend meeting outside india they call themselves as "Indian orthodox church" Only for getting the assets they call themselves as christians, otherwise they are all Kanjikuzhians( Please visit the methran kashi churches built after 1912 for proofs and compare the churches built before 1912 )when christians conducted sunnahadosses in Nikhya,kusthantheenosepolis and effesose methran kashi conducted it at Kottayam muncipal ground and Kolenchery college canteen

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  27. Sad to see so many heated comments...Im not commenting on Kolencherry church issue , as i dont really know the local scenario,but i want to bring one thing in to notice..
    India from as early as first centuries of AD had a christian presence,and by 7th or 8 th century we can defintely say this local church has been in association with Persian Church.Persian Prelates supported this church through local administrator whoom we now name as Archdeacon,the Church of East goverened by Catholicos-Patriarch of Celucia had been out of Church of Roman Empire & being associated with Nestorian theology had in no way connection to the Syrian Church of Antioch.

    This has been a historic fact & is accepted by almost all historians.Ask Syro Malabar Catholic Church or any historians.

    So the point is the Antochian Patriarch comes into Indian church history only on 17th century after Archdeacon Thomas & St. Thomas christians denied to accept roman administration.

    So the claim Jacobite church(Antiochian Church) has been here from very old time is confusing.It originally came to answer the call for help of the native Archdeacon Thomas.And it did help and over the course of history it transfered the traditions & liturgy to the indian church replacing the old East Persian Liturgy.

    But to claim that Jacobite Church is the mother church is false & misleading. It only supported once weakened church ,against its Roman aggression.And as a reward for that help that pertained over past 2 centuries, the syrian Patriarch is made a spiritual father of in the 1934 constitution.

    And to deny the St. Thomas Identity in Malabar church is not posiible, St. Thomas christains were historically,cultarally different.And during troubled ancient conditions where travelling was very dangerous there has been many times for may be upto acentury they were left without a bishop from Persia, to be locally administered by the Arch deacon only.


    So please read history atleast some of the wikipedia articles about St Thomas christains, before delivering the false claims about the Jacobite Church presence in India for time immemorial.

    And the Spiritual Head of the local church grew from that of Arch deacon-->Malankara Metropolitan-->Catholicos in India.

    And Never that we are against Patriarch or Syriac Orthodox Church.
    We are grateful to them, but lets not get divided and stand together.

    It really sad to see the St Thomas christians who where once united now stranded across different factions..
    Syro-Malabar,Orthodox,Jacobite and other reformed churches, all belonged to one church of Malabar.God alone protect St. Thomas christians & the brotherhood among them.

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  28. Kolenchery church was under the patriarch of Antioch before 21st century. Money and manipulation make injustice.

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  29. MY dear Jacobite brothers please go and study malankara church history
    then u argue.The relation between Malankara and Antioch started on 1665.Before that we dnt have any relation with them.Then how all our church comes under antioch.You guys please use your brains.The Antioch s are like british. british ruled India for long time. but now we are independent. Now our head is an indian and its our right to select him not the british . this is same in church case please realize. we are brothers our father should be an indian not a foreigner.Through away the Antioch chain and be a patriot malankarite.Indian Orthodox Church have the majority in malankara.Actually all the churches that built before 2002 comes under the CATHOLICOS of the east and THE MALANKARA METROPOLITAN...we all are ashamed of you.please come back to the mother church the first church in India established by St.Thomas

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  30. Then u people throw away the relation with jesus christ as he is from another country

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  31. who told st thomas started ioc... st thomas did not even appoint a successor in india after him ....all christians of india have the right to clame st thomas tradition...ioc is making fool of people in the name of st thomas...even st thomas might not no who are these indian orthodox are ...ioc catholicos was appointed by patriarc who is the successor of st peter in 1912...and they say we are appointed by st thomas .......u are realy mad comparing th holy syriac orthodox church with british ....we the syiac orthodox people have no division within us based on our country...we are proud to be jacobites weather we are indian or arab or german....our church was not born by cheating like yours ....god is with us we jacobite people will fight till death to save our holy church...god will help us he saw our suffering....ioc is just lie an ant and claims to be elephant....even 90% of the people of india dont know what is indian orthodox...they call patriarc foreigner...i think they dont know that jesus and st thomas are foreigner..stupid people church is made globaly bloody raciest ioc people go to hell ....god help us from these ioc dogs....

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  32. Now with the new supereme court verdict on July 3 2017. The kolenchery church is the integral part of Malankara Orthodox Church .
    This

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